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Hi everyone. And welcome back to Bluffer's Guide to craft beer.欢迎回到我们的《酒馆装B指南》精酿的高级版，and welcome back our beer guru，James.

Yeah, I have been promoted from just James to James beer guru.

Right. So in the previous episode James was telling us about the basic or some of the more popular types of beer and how is beer made.

Right.

But now let's start with the actual craft beer trend if any of you who are listening to this show if you have been to a 精酿place, you know that the beer they are significantly more expensive than the beer you buy like Qingdao or Yanjing or Xuehua for that matter.

Yeah.

But why is that？Is it just because of those types of beer they're produced in bulk like Qingdao?

Ok, one of the biggest reasons for price is bulk, like Qingdao, they produce a lot so they can buy things in bulk, and bulk rate，you know unit price is lower; microbreweries buy in smaller batches so they pay higher amounts.

They also tend to buy more expensive grains so a lot of places like Qingdao one of the main grains in Qingdao is rice, in China rice is cheap. Whereas a lot of craft breweries they don't use rice they're using barley wheat and other grains which cost more.

OK, but based on your knowledge like are these microbreweries or craft breweries？Are they like gradually going to become more mainstream so that they can produce in bulk and lower their prices？

Well, that's what's happened in America for a lot of them. And even in China to some extent，because there have been craft breweries in China that have been purchased by the big companies.

Oh, like Budweiser.

Yeah, so like one of the ones from shanghai Boxing Cat was bought by Budweiser.

I see.

So they do this because usually Budweiser what they'll do is they'll let them still produce their beer but then Budweiser will act as their distributor.

I don't know, it's like a big brand，but this brand perhaps is more mid-range，but then they have like a higher end product line, that sort of thing.

Right.

Ah, I see, it's very common.

Let me ask you about the trends though, you've been in Beijing all these years, and then you have basically seen the microbrewery or craft brewery seem really taken up.

Explode would be the word I'd used in Beijing.

It just in the past 10 years, no?

It's been about the past 10 years, I think it all started with Great Leap brewery(大跃精酿).

Yeah, one of my favorites.

It's my Favorite as well, when they started their place in the Hutong here in Beijing, and now they have expanded to multiple pubs in Beijing，they have a pub now in Chengdu, they have a canning plant in Tianjin.

So they have grown from this small little Hutong hole in the wall to being a multi establishment craft brewery that you can buy their beer anywhere in China now thanks to Taobao.

Yeah, exactly you can buy it on Jingdong, on Taobao, on all of the e-commerce platforms.

But what about in America, when did this whole craft brewery thing start.

It really kind of started in the 80s in places like San Diego and the Pacific Northwest where I'm from，but it really didn't catch on till about mid to the late 90s when a lot of places open up their laws about what you can make and produce. And over the past, I would say 35 year, that it is just spread across all over the country. In America, You'll find craft breweries everywhere.

In every town.

Not every town, but many towns，small towns，big cities have multiple ones. They are now just as almost as ubiquitous as Budweiser in terms of your beer options.

So it's very common to go to any bars and have craft beer.

Available.

Available. And it's still obviously popular now.

My question is who are the target clientele？Is it mostly men maybe？

Beer tends to be drunk mostly by men，but women drink it, too. The thing about craft beer is you can make all kinds of different flavors that appeal to wide audience.

Exactly I've noticed a lot of women like craft brewery nowadays because they have these very fruity lower alcohol content.

So there's a wide variety of flavors, in terms of the American public, they tend to be more popular about middle class that higher social economic status because they are more expensive. If you're going to go to a bar and order a craft beer, it's probably going to be about 2 to $3 more expensive than one of the... like Budweiser.

Yeah, I think in China it's even more expensive.

There's a pretty big price gap in bars between like if you order Qingdao might be 20RMB whereas the craft beer might be double.

Well, at least double.

At least.

Sometimes 60 70.

Easily.

In that way, it's seen as because usually if you think about beer drinking，a lot of people would still traditionally associate it with: oh, this is not as let's say sophisticated as wine drinking or whiskey drinking，but nowadays craft beer is pretty high up there.

Yeah，it gets pretty sophisticated people make all kinds of interesting concoctions and interesting flavors, and a lot of people who drink craft bear tend not to drink the same way as you drink Lager. You don't drink as much of it as it cost a lot.

And you appreciate it more.

Yeah, appreciate it more. Plus after you had a few，you stop caring. Alcohol will eventually catch up with you.

Another thing I've noticed is these craft beer places，these craft beer bars or pubs. They always seem to have a specific style. They're not like your wine bar or your whiskey bar or your like cocktail bars.

So you mean like the kind of industrial look，the hardwood tables，hardwood chairs，hardwood floor，hardwood bar，hardwood everything.

Let's say, I don't know if “manly” is more the way to talk about it, but it's not like cocktail bars where is more sort of I shall say very decorated to suit female taste that...

So, yeah, that's actually what they would look like in America too is that like wood everything. Because for one, this kind of brewery started in the Western States which we have a lot of forests over there.

So wood is plentiful and so making bars with lots of hardwoods is pretty easy and low cost; and it just kind of stuck. So if you go to places here in Beijing like Great Leap, Jing A or Slow Boat, they will all have this look of these hardwood kind of industrial big space which is what you would come across if you went to America.

The other thing you would see commonly is adapting local styles into it.

Oh, yes. One of my favorite Great Leap in Beijing is in the Hutong.

The original one.

Yeah, the original one.

They've got this little courtyard thing and then you sit there and you think oh, this is Beijing.

Yeah, it got a little mix of Beijing culture with very American wood benches and wood tables.

One thing I've noticed is some of the places they actually have the brewing equipment on display, is that a thing?

That's quite common. Not all places do this because in some places brewing in a separate location is more cost effective，but that's not uncommon at all. Because people want to see how the beer is made. People want to see the fermenting tanks. They want to see where they're cooking the malts to get the flavors out and all this stuff. So it is quite common in some places they have partial brewing in the pub and the rest of the brewing would be done at a separate location.

Partial brewing is more like for show to give it the ambiance. And now let's move on to food. What's the best in your mind？What's the best food that goes with craft beer?

I will drink craft beer with any food.

But in general，most people if they were to think, it would be burgers.

Bar snacks.

Bar snacks. You got a lot of craft brew pubs in America，it's gonna be burgers，sandwiches, pizzas，hot wings...

Nothing healthy.

You're going to a bar, healthy is not exactly your top priority here.

Some people would drink wine and eat salad，but you don't see people drinking craft beer and eating salad.

Not really.

So where I'm from in the Pacific Northwest，it's not uncommon to see seafood on the menu because we're by the coast so we have it. So you see some place with oysters，fish and chips, crab and things like that. So there will be...

Sliders.

Sliders which are mini burgers.

Yeah.

So burgers are common，whatever is local，so there are places with tacos in the Southwest. You probably go to New York Chinatown and find a craft brewery that's doing with Chinese food.

Yeah, the last craft beer place I went in Beijing also very popular I had 煎饼with Beijing duck filling.

That sounds pretty good.

Really good, I highly recommend it.

I always thought a good idea would be open up a craft brewery place in China, and so either like Xi'an，肉夹馍 or Northwest China 烤串儿

I think that would be a great combination. You will make lots of money.

Honestly, it's not that far from the reality because now for example Great Leap that Hutong place, you know what they do?

You just order 外卖。

Exactly. You just order on 饿了么 or any of those platforms. They couldn't even be bothered to have a kitchen anymore because everyone wants different food.

I don't think there are a lot to have a kitchen there to be honest because it's too small.

Probably not, so easy to just order because you have a courtyard，you can sit outside. I've see people on different tables, they're all drinking really expensive craft beer，but they're eating like 串儿，they eating fried chicken.

We have already spent money on the beer, we're not going to waste money on food.

Exactly. It's fantastic.

Okay，I think we're gonna wrap up here. It's been fun these two episodes about the basic of craft beer, craft brewery. Thank you beer guru.

Thank you and if our audiences want to hear more，we can definitely talk more about beer in the future.

I know you would like that or maybe whisky.

I'll take both together you know.

If you also are into craft beer or if you have tasted craft beer before or if there are some of these craft beer pubs in your city that you frequent. Let us know in the comment section, we might try your pups as well.

Leave us a comment, we'll see you next time. Thank you.

Cheers.

Bye.