英文文本-第一部分

Dragon TV Interview: Developing a Comprehensive, Integrated Dialogue With China
Hillary Rodham Clinton

Secretary of State

Interview With Yang Lan of Dragon TV

Beijing, China

February 22, 2009

MS. YANG: But this is a beautiful Embassy.

SECRETARY CLINTON: Isn't it? I am so proud and impressed by it. It took a long time to build, but it is very beautiful and very functional. And the architecture is Chinese-inspired, so it's really a wonderful addition to our embassy community.

MS. YANG: And so you are going back today, right?

SECRETARY CLINTON: Yes. I have to go back today.

MS. YANG: And just in time to celebrate your daughter's 29th birthday.

SECRETARY CLINTON: That's true. She will be 29 on Friday. And I am very much looking forward to seeing her for a birthday dinner.

MS. YANG: Okay. So what kind of path do you like to see her take? I know she has been studying health policy and management at Columbia.

SECRETARY CLINTON: That's right. I think she is someone who charts her own path, and I am very impressed and delighted at the choices that she has made. I just, like most mothers, want her to be happy and have a good life. And that is really all I wish for her.

MS. YANG: Does she resemble you in the ways that she does things?

SECRETARY CLINTON: I think she is a good combination of both her father and me. She has a very wonderful personality, and she is a hard worker, and she is a good friend and a caring person. So I am just very happy to be her mother.

MS. YANG: I know you have just had a dialogue with the Chinese women. Some of them you have known for 11 years. Well, to the younger generation of women, like your daughters, what kind of advice would you like to give to those who aspire to succeed and lead, but could be afraid of failure?

SECRETARY CLINTON: Well, that's a good way of phrasing the question, because I think that overcoming your fears, whether you're a young woman or a young man, to be willing to take a risk, to try something different, to follow your heart, to pursue your dreams, takes a certain level of courage.

And I just try to tell young people who ask me all the time what I think about the best way forward is to be true to themselves, you know, to listen to their own heart, to do what gives them joy in life, and meaning in their public and professional careers. And I think if you do that, you may change, you may take a different path. But if you can keep focused on what you believe is important, I think that's the best way to proceed.

MS. YANG: Let's get back to this trip. In your testimony to the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, you suggested that U.S. should use smart power to handle international issues. How is that approach, or strategy, reflected in your Asian trip, especially your trip to China?

SECRETARY CLINTON: Well, it is our goal in the Obama administration to reach out to the rest of the world using every tool at our disposal. I like to talk about the three D's of our foreign policy: defense, diplomacy, development.

We want to emphasize, particularly, diplomacy and development. And what I have tried to do in the month that I have had this position is to make clear that we will represent and defend the interests and the security and the values of the United States, but we want to listen.

We are different countries and different cultures. China and the United States have very different histories. And we need to understand each other better so that we can find more common ground. And I was encouraged by my talks with your leadership, that there are a number of areas we can work on together.

We are constructing, and have agreed, in principle, to a strategic and economic dialogue that will not only include the economic crisis, which is very important, that China and America lead on a recovery, globally, but clean energy and climate change, and more educational exchanges, and people-to-people exchanges, more work on health care, medicine, science.

I want to deepen and broaden the connections, not only between government officials, as important at that is, but between all kinds of Chinese and Americans.

英文文本-第二部分

MS. YANG: You know, former Treasury Secretary Paulson used to champion the U.S.-Sino dialogue in the structure of the Strategic Economic Dialogue. Have you convinced President Obama to let the State Department take back the reigns? And, if so, what kind of new framework of dialogue are we talking about?

SECRETARY CLINTON: Well, we are going to have a comprehensive, integrated dialogue. It will be co-chaired by myself and the Treasury Secretary, because I think there was an awareness that our prior engagement at the dialogue level, government-to-government, was very heavily dominated by economic concerns, and by traditional Treasury priorities. They are very important but that is not the only high-level dialogue that needs to occur.

So, we have always had a lot of interaction at many levels of our governments. But what we want to do is to integrate those, and to have our two Presidents, when they meet at the G-20 summit in April, announce the mechanism that we will be pursuing now.

MS. YANG: Have you found the terminology to define the relationship between our two countries? Because under your husband's administration we called it "constructive strategic partnership," and then, in the Bush administration we called it "stakeholders." Have you found the new words yet?

SECRETARY CLINTON: Well, I'm not as interested in the words as in the actions. I think that we have evolved dramatically in our relationship over the 30 years that we have had diplomatic relations. China has grown just exponentially in a way that is a real tribute to the people of China.

But what we now need to do is demonstrate that the United States and China can work productively together, not only on those issues that we have bilateral concerns over, but to show leadership to the rest of the world.

If you just take two major issues confronting the world, I don't think it's realistic to expect that we will see global recovery without Chinese and American cooperation and leadership. I know that it is not realistic to expect that we can deal with global climate change without the United States and China working together.

So, what we are talking about is very concrete and specific. It is not so much the description, as the reality and the content of what we will do together that we're focusing on.

MS. YANG: Okay. You quoted Chinese story, (speaks Chinese), which means, "We are in the same boat" to tackle economic crisis.

SECRETARY CLINTON: Yes.

MS. YANG: Yet, at the same time, the "Buy American" rhetoric triggered another round of fear of protectionism. How would the U.S. government reconcile the international responsibility with the demand of domestic constituencies?

SECRETARY CLINTON: Well, President Obama was very quick to act, and to make clear that we are not going to engage in protectionism. And, with respect to the provision that was in the stimulus package, it must be compliant with our international agreements.

We know that a round of protectionism is not in America's interests. It's important that we work with countries like China, and others, to establish a framework for renewed economic growth and prosperity.

Now, we also have work to do at home. Not only do we have to stimulate our economy, but we have to be working to enhance our manufacturing base, work on our automobile industry. So we have a lot of internal decision-making that is important to our economic future. And I think China does, too. mean, China is stimulating your economy at the central government level. You are looking to deal with problems like migrant workers who no longer have jobs.

So, we each have our own internal domestic challenges. But we cannot solve those at the expense of generating global growth again, which will benefit both of our people.

MS. YANG: You certainly have your hands full, with all sorts of challenges and problems around the world, from Iraq to Gaza Strip, from nuclear proliferation to climate change. And then, of course, the economic crisis.

How would you set an achievable target for your term, as secretary of state?

SECRETARY CLINTON: Well, it's true, that we have come into office at a time of so many problems. You mentioned a few of the most well known. I don't know that we can pick and choose. It's one of the reasons why I have advocated the appointment of special envoys, because I think we need, as they say, all hands on deck. Everyone has to work hard together to try to untangle some of these problems, to look for solutions where possible.

So, I don't have the luxury of saying, "I will only work on this." I have to be very conscious of everything going on in the world. But I did choose to come, for my first trip, to Asia, because I want to send a clear message that the United States is both a trans-Pacific, as well as a trans-Atlantic power, and that much of what we see as the potential for positive growth and good relations in the 21st century will come with Asian countries like China.

MS. YANG: Thank you very much for your time, although it falls short of my questions. Well, can I squeeze just one more?

SECRETARY CLINTON: Sure.

MS. YANG: Do you think that China should further invest into American treasury bonds? Because there is a debate here - with unclear future, we should stop buying more.

SECRETARY CLINTON: Well, I certainly do think that the Chinese government and the central bank here in China is making a very smart decision by continuing to invest in treasury bonds for two reasons.

First, because it's a good investment. It's a safe investment. Even despite the economic challenges sweeping over the world, the United States has a well-deserved financial stability reputation.

And, secondly, because our economies are so intertwined. The Chinese know that, in order to start exporting again to its biggest market, namely, the United States, the United States has to take some very drastic measures with this stimulus package, which means we have to incur more debt.

It would not be in China's interest if we were unable to get our economy moving again. So, by continuing to support American treasury instruments, the Chinese are recognizing our interconnection. We are truly going to rise or fall together. We are in the same boat. And, thankfully, we are rowing in the same direction, toward landfall.

MS. YANG: Okay. So we have to keep rowing?

SECRETARY CLINTON: Yes.

MS. YANG: Thank you very much, Secretary Clinton.

SECRETARY CLINTON: Thank you.

中文文本-第一部分

2009年2月22日
北京，美国大使馆

美国国务卿希拉里·克林顿把此次访华唯一一个电视专访的机会给了《杨澜访谈录》让我们深感荣幸。不管是因为作为奥巴马政府对中美两国态度的“表态”，还是应对当今全球共同面对的金融危机，希拉里的来访都足够让人瞩目。

采访地点定在美国大使馆。路上我们感受着北京春天阳光的温和，相信今天的采访也会和这早春的阳光一样暖融融。美国大使馆是北京使馆区最新的“一份子”，设计中体现了中国的元素。当希拉里一身藏蓝色西服、配着别致的饰品，在众多随从官员的陪伴下出现在我们视野中的时候，现场的人体会到一种朝气勃发。

第一次采访希拉里，但并不是第一次见到希拉里。与1998年她作为第一夫人跟从肯林顿总统访华的时期相比，今天的希拉里显得更加轻松，这恐怕是自信程度的不同吧！当我见到她本人向她提到这一印象时，希拉里爽朗的笑笑说：“也许是因为我够老了吧！”

采访时间：7分钟

为了平衡中外媒体的采访要求，希拉里的新闻官给《杨澜访谈录》安排了7分钟的采访时间。7分钟，我们以秒计时。顺利的是，我们的问题都得到了希拉里的回答。在我与希拉

里谈兴正浓的时候，一直陪在希拉里旁边的新闻官示意栏目组时间到了。但是作为一个记者，我怎么能够放弃这个机会，在最后时刻我又及时提出了一两个问题。希拉里听到后，对她的新闻官欣然摆了摆手，说：“不，我愿意回答这些问题。”就这样，在希拉里的帮助下我们的采访时间从7分钟延长到10多分钟。

采访结束后，希拉里邀请我们有机会去美国再对她进行采访，那样会有更充裕的时间。

我与希拉里同为母亲

“切尔西是个有主见的人”

切尔西-克林顿现在就读于哥伦比亚大学，主修卫生政策和管理。

“你希望她朝什么方向发展？”我问到。希拉里说：“我觉得她是很有主见的人，我对她自己的选择都很支持。就像大多数母亲一样，我只要她高兴就好，希望她生活得好，我只要求这些。”

“她综合了我和他父亲的优点”

对于一个母亲而言，切尔西给希拉里带来了很强烈的幸福感。希拉里很骄傲的说切尔西“综合了我和她父亲的优点”。“她性格很好，工作努力；她是个很好的朋友，也很有爱心。”

在说到切尔西时希拉里滔滔不绝，最后希拉里由衷地说：“我作为母亲觉得很幸运。”

职业女性希拉里

“要倾听自己的心声，要做自己喜欢做的事”

作为一个职业女性，希拉里也取得了令人羡慕的成就。在退出美国总统候选人竞选转而支持奥巴马的时候，作为一个职业女性来讲，她所表现出来的气度和面对挫折的态度足以令人敬佩。

在这次访华的过程中，希拉里也和一些中国女性进行了对话。她们中，有些人是十一年前认识的；有些人，像切尔西一样年轻。对于那些有志向追求成功、希望扮演领袖角色的却又担心失败的女性，希拉里建议她们“要倾听自己的心声，要做自己喜欢做的事”。希拉里说：“不管是青年男性还是女性，战胜恐惧、承担风险；不随波逐流、而去追求梦想，是需要相当的勇气的。”对于“什么是最好的人生方向”，希拉里也有自己的见解，她说：“每次有年轻人问我什么是最好的人生方向，我总是说‘要充分认识和相信自己’。做那些充实他们的社会生活和职业生涯的事，那样的话他们可能会经历变化、他们的人生道路可能会有曲折，但是我觉得追求自己觉得重要的事业是最好的生活方式。”

国务卿希拉里

1、“巧实力”如何在这次中亚之行中体现出来的

问：你对参议院外交委员会作证的时候，说到美国应该在国际事务中运用“巧实力”。这个策略在你这次亚洲之行，尤其是对中国的访问中是如何体现的？

答：在奥巴马政府中，我们的目标是“运用一切手段加强与世界各国的关系。”在外交政策方面我总是说三个“D”，也就是防卫、外交和发展，我们尤其要重视外交和发展这两项。

我上任这一个月以来，一直重申我们要代表和保卫美国的利益、安全和价值观，但是我们乐意倾听。我们两个国家非常不同，中国和美国有着截然不同的历史，我们需要更好地相互了解，以便发现更多的共同点。(这次访华)我和中国领导人的会谈让我很受鼓舞，我们有多个领域是可以展开合作的。我们原则上确定要建立经济方面的战略对话，不仅是在应对经济危机方面进行交流，这当然很重要。而美国和中国都要在推动全球复苏方面扮演领导角色，同时还要谈清洁能源、气候变化，更多的教育交流、人文交流、医疗卫生、科学技术方面的工作。我希望我们的联系更深更广，政府官员之间的联系很重要，但是中美各种人群之间的联系也要发展。

中文文本-第二部分

2、相比于保尔森，在奥巴马政府中国务院在中美对话中的地位

问：前美国财政部长保尔森一直积极推动中美对话，就像你说的战略经济对话。你是否说服了奥巴马总统恢复国务院在这项工作上的主导地位？如果是的话，这一对话的框架会是什么样的？

答：我们的对话将是全面和整体的，我会和财政部长共同主持这一对话。因为确实有一种情况，就是以前我们政府间的对话明显偏向于经济问题，是由传统的财政问题主导的，这些问题非常重要，但是还有很多其他的议题是需要高层次交流的。我们两国政府的各个层次一直有很多交流，但是我们希望整合这些交流。我们两国首脑将会在四月的G20峰会见面，到时他们会宣布我们的对话机制。

3、定位两国关系的词汇——对于辞令来说，我更重视行动

问：你有没有找到给我们两国关系定位的词汇？你丈夫领导的政府把这一关系称为“建设性的战略伙伴”，布什政府称两国为“利益相关方”，你找到一个新的说法了吗？

答：相对于辞令来说，我更重视行动。我觉得我们的关系在建交三十年来经历了戏剧性的变化。中国的巨大发展是应该令中国人自豪的，我们现在需要证明的是：美国和中国能够进行有效的合作，这不限于双边事务，而是要在世界上扮演领导的角色。就说现在世界面临的两个重大问题，没有美中的合作和主导，对全球经济复苏的期待就是不现实的。我确信，应对气候变化也离不开美国和中国的合作。所以我们的计划是很实际和具体的，在我们的合作上 ，我们关心的不是名目，而是在具体的内容。

4、“买美国货”和“同舟共济”

问：你引用了一个中国典故“同舟共济”来表达我们要携手应对经济危机，而与此同时“买美国货”的论调又引发了对贸易保护主义的担忧。美国政府如何来平衡它的国际义务和国内的政治压力？

答：奥巴马总统及时表明了我们不会奉行保护主义经济刺激计划中的条款，必须在遵守国际协议的前提下实行。我们知道，贸易保护主义对美国是不利的，我们需要和中国等国家一起建立一个让经济发展和繁荣的框架。我们在国内也有功课要做，不仅是刺激经济我们还要强化制造业、改革汽车工业，所以说我们自己需要做很多决策来保证我们的经济的未来。我觉得中国也是。中国的中央政府在采取刺激经济的行动，你们在应对失业民工的问题。我们两国都有自己的国内问题的挑战，但是我们不能为了解决这些问题而牺牲全球经济增长，因为我们的人民需要这种增长。

5、如何设立可实现的工作目标

问：你在工作中要面对全世界的无数的挑战和问题：伊拉克到加沙，从核扩散到气候变化，当然还有经济危机。你是怎么给自己的国务卿任期设立可实现的工作目标的？

答：确实这一届政府一上任就面临无数问题。你举了几个最令人瞩目的例子，我们不能顾此失彼，这也是我提出了任命特使的原因之一。因为我们需要全面动员，每个人都要全力以赴、精诚合作来寻找解决这些问题的办法。在工作上我不能挑三拣四，而要随时注意全球的各种问题。但是我还是把第一次出访选在亚洲，因为我想发出一个明确的信息，那就是美国的影响力不仅是跨大西洋的，也是跨太平洋的。我们认为在经济增长和友好关系方面二十一世纪的亚洲，包括中国都有很大的潜力。

6、是否增持美国国债

问：你觉得中国是否应该继续投资于美国国债？因为在中国有人认为由于前景不明朗，我们不应该再增持。

答：我当然觉得中国政府和中央银行继续购买美国国债是很明智的选择。有两个原因：首先这是一项好的投资、安全的投资。即使全球遭遇经济危机，美国经济仍然稳定、信用依旧良好；另外，我们两国的经济是密不可分的。中国知道如果想恢复对她的最大的出口市场，也就是美国的出口，美国需要采取强有力的措施来刺激经济，也就是说我们需要进一步举债。要是我们不能恢复我们的经济，对中国也是不利的。选择继续支持美国国债显示了中国是认识到我们的经济联系的。我们需要共进退，我们确实要同舟共济。好在我们步调一致，正在划向彼岸。

From:口译网